Women in the Business Arena™ EP83: Stop Marketing Authenticity & Be Authentic

The people who are truly authentic, the ones who've really done the work, they've worked on the congruence of themselves. They've done the internal work out of the limelight. You cannot do the work in the limelight. Period

This week on Women in the Business Arena, we are reclaiming the word “authenticity!” There are so many of us that are craving authenticity in our business and life. It seems the word authenticity has been commandeered by society and used for shows of excessive vulnerability, marketing ploys, or as a facade to cover over insecurities.  It is possible to be genuinely authentic in our lives and our businesses. 

The people that I find who are sharing their integration as it's happening, they're actually stopping themselves from having the full integration...the second that you put a selfie on it, the second that you turn it around and do it for someone else, you're stopping the process of your own integration.

In order to have the freedom to be authentic with others, we are responsible to first do the work in the privacy of our homes, therapist’s office, or with trusted friends and mentors. When we try to find integration in the limelight, posting about it before we have processed it internally, we lose our authenticity. When we achieve integration of that part of ourselves, our authenticity will flow naturally, and others will be drawn to it. 

“The more work you do internally, and the more ready you are internally in your business, because you have the right structures, and skills…  the more ready you are, the more authentic you are naturally. You don't have to try to be authentic. You are authentic.

Authenticity is not something that we have to strive to achieve. When we take the time to discover and take ownership of the parts of ourselves, allowing integration to give way to a confidence, authenticity will naturally flow from us. When we know who we are, and we're doing it with good intention, then it's totally from a powerful place. And then promotion, marketing and sales are authentic. 

“Whether you like the word authentic, don't like the work authentic, it doesn't really matter. What we're looking for is for you to be congruent with yourself, for you to know who you are, for you to stand for who you are. Stop compromising for the world, for other people, for your marketing, for your promotion, just stop compromising yourself altogether.”

Some Topics we talk about in this episode: 

  • Introduction - 0:56
  • When Authenticity Became Inauthentic - 3:25
  • Authenticity as a Marketing Ploy - 5:00
  • Congruence Before Authenticity - 8:29
  • The Mature Divine Feminine - 15:08
  • Why It’s NOT About Faking It Til You Make It - 18:48
  • Being Aligned With Your Product or Service - 25:28
  • Wrap-up and Takeaways - 35:39

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Sonya Stattmann: 00:56 Hi, and welcome to the Women in the Business Arena podcast. I'm your host, Sonya Stattman, and I'm here with my gorgeous co-host, Laura Shook Guzman. Hey Laura.

Laura Shook Guzman: 01:05 Hello. I'm well and I'm excited to talk with you again. Always my favorite.

Sonya Stattmann: 01:13 I know. Me too. I love it. We're so lucky. Today we're going to talk about a topic that I do rant about a little bit. I think a lot of other people rant about as well. I am very much an advocate for authenticity and being authentic and I still use the word and I'm always going to use the word because it's real for me. But I do think we have to start to talk about the misuse of authenticity in business. How people are misusing it in marketing, how they're misusing it to justify sort of like an excessive vulnerability maybe or different patterns or for selling. So we thought it would just be really good to kind of dive into a discussion on the misuse of authenticity. What do you think?

Laura Shook Guzman: 02:01 Yes. I am looking forward to this and I have warned Sonya that I might vent or go on a rant. So I will try to like bring that down. But I think that we're all somewhat a little frustrated that something that started off feeling really good for a lot of us as women entrepreneurs, finding our voice through our business felt like fresh air. A breath of fresh air because we came maybe from organizations, corporations, business structures that we didn't feel like we were showing up with our whole selves, that we were sharing our true voice. So when it came to our business it is like, this is my why, this is my message. And then it became something that we heard was good for marketing. Okay, like this is good. I'm telling my story and people are going to really appreciate that. I don't somewhere along the line, people who were influencers and I'm using air quotes, people can't see me, but online influencers decided it was on point. It was a really important trend to follow. And as soon as it became that trend, then it started to lose, interestingly enough, authenticity began to lose its authenticity.

Sonya Stattmann: 03:25 Yeah, I know! And it makes me want to cry because I feel like so many people who are longing to be more authentic, like to actually be real in their business, they're resisting the yuckiness of the new authentic, authentic is the new black. And because of that they're not being authentic. It's so backward. What we've created and what we've come to. And so I think we have to look at how do we take back the authentic word?

Laura Shook Guzman: 04:00 I like it. Let's reclaim authenticity.

Sonya Stattmann: 04:04 That's right. We're going to do it right now here in this podcast.

Laura Shook Guzman: 04:07 Well, like so many things, it is something that starts off really genuine and then once it becomes more egoic, and the ego can have some positive place in our businesses being really clear. But there's this place where it started coming from not over-functioning, we've talked about that a lot, but it's like an overcompensation maybe for like the doubt. Or like I don't know if I'm supposed to be here, I don't know if I'm really am an entrepreneur. Maybe there was some sort of fear or doubt, and then this kind of, so I need to be authentic, I need to tell my story, but then it really wasn't coming from a grounded place of being like, I feel comfortable and safe to share my voice. It became kind of a superficial layer of, well, I'm just going to throw this out there and see if people like it.

Sonya Stattmann: 05:00 Yes. Right. Yes. And that that to me is the crux of it is. That most people are doing it on a surface level. They haven't done the deep work in themselves. They haven't really become authentic. They're using authenticity as a marketing place or as some way to get promotions, some way to get sales, instead of actually being authentic as a way to get sales. There's a huge, huge, huge, huge, huge, huge difference between those two things. And I think the world has grabbed onto another marketing ploy and they're like, okay, it's all surface. It's like branding, like I use this a lot of times in terms of branding and what branding was originally meant to be has been completely lost. I was in branding two decades ago, when it was like deep and real and like really understanding what your customer needs are, how you can support them and help them, and like it was so in depth and now branding's been reduced to like a logo and some pretty colors. There is no longer the depth there, and that's where I think we've gotten with authenticity is that for most people it's like an idea. It's a concept. They have no actual feeling sense with it. They haven't really done the work internally or if they have done the work, they then have a disconnect when they go to portray it in a promotion or in their marketing or in their sales and so that authenticness they actually have, isn't it coming out in.

Laura Shook Guzman: 06:39 And then something else that happens. Well, first of all, your point about branding is so accurate because of the change in technology, like you used to have to hire a marketing firm or boutique company that would help you dive deep into who's your brand, what's your meaning? And now it's like, I'm just going to fill out these little questions worksheet and throw up and online Instagram. I love Instagram, so I'm not saying it, but it's just so easy to not be real on there. Just to kind of throw things up so you don't have to dive deep. And, the thing I see happening also is people using authenticity as a brand value when it's not, doesn't feel quite authentic. It doesn't feel real. So the client kind of feels like they're not good enough. So they hold authenticity in a superior way. That's what I'm trying to say. So like you see brands being like, hi, I am authentic. It's a brand value. And they have this very clear, I wish that everyone could see me. I'm acting right now and I'm like, oh, a brand I'm standing, because it's this feeling that comes out through that profile or that image and then you kind of feel disconnected from that person. You're like, oh, I don't know if I'm good enough. Like somehow you have this corner on the authentic market, like a superiority or one-up kind of thing that people are doing to where you feel like, I need to take your class or do your thing or have your product in order to be authentic like you. There's some sort of playing on that.

Sonya Stattmann: 08:29 It's like an identity. I see this a lot in spiritual circles as well. There's a difference between someone who's actually spiritual and someone who has a spiritual identity. Because when someone has the identity, it's like they're playing it out, but inside they're still not really integrated. And this is where I think the disconnect is: the people who are truly authentic, like the ones who've really done the work, so they've worked on the congruency of themselves, they've done the internal work out of the limelight. You cannot do the work in the limelight. Period. You can feel it. I don't know about everybody else, but when I have a genuine moment of insight or realization, if I instantly turned to my phone and try to take a selfie and write about it, I lose that authenticity. I lose that moment. And so I think the work is done out of the limelight. The work is done internally, in our private affairs, or maybe with an intimate person. That's where the real work is done. And then it might be that once were integrated, once we actually have the authenticity, then we put it out there because that's our expression. It's not that we're selling authenticity, it's that we're selling ourselves. Our integrated selves.

Laura Shook Guzman: 09:42 Yes, I love doing the work outside of the limelight. Your internal work is not something you're going to do in front of an audience. It's the work you're going to do. And even just like the dark night of the soul, we know that expression, and who was ever doing that in public. And that's how people try to do it. They try to do their dark night of the soul on stage and it's not the same. And it's not the same because you're not connected to it if you're in a performance if you are disconnecting enough to take a photo of it. This is why I find I love being able to snap certain pictures to help people see what's happening in my life. But sometimes when I'm on a really great retreat vacation, even a conference, I just want to unplug and be with the experiences because as soon as I take myself out and is like, well this is a great selfie, and oh, I need a picture with these people and I need this moment captured, all the sudden you're no longer in that moment authentically. And 100 percent genuinely the way you are without all of the stuff.

Sonya Stattmann: 11:03 Yes. And so two things I want to say around all of that. So one is, I completely agree with what you just said, which is that the second you think about the selfie, you've disconnected from the moment. And so I know for me, I don't. If you go through my social media, you're rarely going to see any of my real life. It's not because I am scared to show it. Like I'm happy, but I won't record it because it takes me out of the moment. Even I forget to do it at events because I'm in the moment. I'm with people, I want to be with them. And so I don't even think so, like the thousands of events I've done, I rarely have pictures or videos. So it's really like what I've learned for myself is if I want to record it, I hire someone to do it. Someone who can be fully present in what they're doing and I can be fully present and what I'm doing. And that works for me. But I also think one of the things we have to look at is the people that I find who are sharing their integration as it's happening. They're actually stopping themselves from having the full integration. It's almost like an ego ploy. Like it's one of those ways then they can avoid the real work and so lots of people might argue with me, you're welcome to please bring it on. I love discussions. But I have seen over and over again, it's another way for people to avoid owning their responsibility and what's happening for them, really feeling it really going deep. Because the second that you put a selfie on it, the second that you turn it around and do it for someone else, you're stopping the process of your own integration. And I have been guilty of it as well. Although I don't take selfies, I do write a lot. So I'll find that sometimes I'm journaling and I'm having a moment having realization. I'm like, oh my gosh, I should put this in my next blog or I should put this online. And this second time I turn around and start to do it as something I'm going to put out there, It changes the whole energy of it. It changes the integration level of it, so now I stopped myself. I won't let myself do that anymore because I take myself out of my own integration of it. You guys, there's no way around this. You really cannot have true integration and be portraying it publicly. It does not work.

Laura Shook Guzman: 13:12 Yes, because it starts using the left side of the brain more than the right side. The right side of the brain is the experience, and when you're in meditation, actually one of the reasons why it feels so good is because it shifts you into the right brain. And the left brain is like busy doing all the thinking and the writing, but that's why you know you do opposite handwriting or you do a stream of consciousness. All of that is to get more right brain flow. As soon as you turn it into a blog article in the middle of your integration, all of a sudden you've shifted from your state, your real like sensation-present-state-being-brain into your brain that likes to play in. It's thinking about what you wrote before, it's thinking about what you're going to write tomorrow and who's going to think it, who's going to read it, and then all the sudden that's not the same and it doesn't tap your unconscious the same. There's not that like flow or the downloads that people feel like it's coming from their wiser self or a higher self. All of that happens when you're really present. I think that we are really getting at why because in spiritual teachers right now, there's the same thing that we're seeing where there's kind of some criticism that there are so many people that are calling themselves spiritual teachers and they haven't done the inner work. And they're entrepreneurs that are calling themselves the experts and they really haven't done the work yet. And just because it's a branding point or it's on point or trendy. You have to think like, is it true for me right now? Because jumping on that bandwagon just because it's the thing to do, people are going to feel when it's not where you are. We're all of a sudden you jumped ahead or joined a group that, you haven't done any of the prep work to be there yet.

Sonya Stattmann: 15:08 Yeah. And I think we've just lost the value of the integration component. It really is reflecting back to me. So one of the things I talked about in a lot of episodes and one of my own sort of very personal journeys is around integrating myself more into what I'm calling the "mature divine feminine." And I've talked about Judith Dearth books a lot in these in podcasts. They're sort of like my little bibles for the feminine thing I'm exploring at the moment, but she talks a lot about the world is crying for the mature divine feminine because so much of the feminine is shallow at the moment. And the mature divine feminine, what I take that in and in my own exploration, is it's really the integrated feminine. It's the mature feminine that has discovered itself, that has owned itself, that has become itself. It isn't an idea or a concept of what we need to be. It is, we have become it and that's what I think is happening in terms of this authenticness is that it's all a concept. It's all an idea and then the idea is portrayed in a shallow way. Like crying vulnerably on Facebook Live to me is not authentic. Like to me that is actually the opposite. And so I'm totally turned off by that and I know that for some people that works and that. Yeah, and that's okay. I appreciate it. But to me that's again like oversharing and not really having the integration before you put it out there and you know, this is where I think our responsibility is as well, like to be authentic, to be real. I think if we are in a vulnerable state, but we haven't yet integrated ourselves on a topic, I don't think that is the domain of the public. I think that is the domain of our therapists, that's the domain of our friends. That's the domain of our own internal journey. It's not the domain of everyone until I'm integrated. It doesn't mean I'm still not vulnerable in sharing a story that is embarrassing or a story that is challenging, but because I've done the integration that makes it fit for the public. And I think Brene Brown does a really good job of talking some about that as well in some books.

Laura Shook Guzman: 17:25 Yeah. I was thinking about that. I think we've referenced her or somebody asking her about that. She talks about that in her book, where in her mind important that you do that work to process something before you go and share it publicly. So you're still going to be vulnerable, but you need to know that you understand yourself and what's going on for you here before you bring it into that public domain because then it changes the way you relate to it. And I think that we are hungry for authenticity. I think as a society, we are hungry for vulnerability and truth and integrity. So sometimes, just like at different times in my life, when you you really wanted something to happen and you go before you're really there. I'm trying to think of example. But you get so excited and you just want it so badly that you do it before you've really inhabited that space or before you can really embody it, but your mind wants it. So you try it. You start acting as if it's already true.

Sonya Stattmann: 18:40 Yes. And, and I am not a fan of “fake it til you make it.”

Laura Shook Guzman: 18:45 I do not like that expression either.

Sonya Stattmann: 18:48 And I know some people are really a fan of sort of the Amy Cuddy thing as well, like you know the TedX talk and the power moves and I get that. That's cool. But there is still a layer of fake it till you make it there and I'm just not a fan of that concept at all. I think integrate and then be it. Like the work can still be done. You're not sitting there not doing anything but you're working on the integration so that you actually become it. And it's funny because I had someone last night say something like that I am really able to sort of portray, I guess myself like more authentically and vulnerably in an easy way. And I was thinking it's not an easy way. I've just done a lot of work. I've done so much work on myself. Since I was a young child even, I think I read my first self-development book at nine. I've just done so much work on myself that I'm more integrated. And then I'm able to just be myself without worrying about what people think about me, about worrying about how my image comes across, and not that I don't ever have doubts about myself or self-consciousness because I'm human. But, I think I worry less about that. And instead I'm presenting what I believe, I'm presenting my truth, I'm presenting my values, so I'm just more integrated presenting myself. And I think that what we have to realize is it's about the work. It's not about the promotion, it's not about marketing, it's about the work. The more work you do internally and the more ready you are internally in your business because you have the right structures, in your skills like in how to sell and all of that. All of the things I teach in my program, the more ready you are, the more authentic you are naturally. You don't have to try to be authentic. You are authentic.

Laura Shook Guzman: 20:41 Yes! And that's like the aging of a teacher. It's like you don't just go from student to teacher just because you want so badly to be that mentor or teacher. I couldn't have been the mentor I am today 10 years ago because I didn't have the experience. I couldn't have just been that because I wanted it to be. And now it's like, oh, I'm actually here. I am the one that's able to talk to the young woman in her twenties and help guide her. That's just a rite of passage that. And I think that is something in our society where we're so focused on do it quick or entrepreneurs under 30. It's like why are we focused on how quick it can be done or how young you are going to be to do it. Really the gift is in maturity, in the mature divine feminine or the aging spiritual teacher or the business leaders. Because the more that we learn, the more that we integrate and we can show up. And that's I think why you feel it from certain people that have been in the work for years. You can hear them talk about it and you're like, I don't even question their authenticity. It's like really feel it. Why is that? Well, because they've done that work. And even just our conversations that we're having on this podcast that we started having the last year, we started these conversations over 10 years ago. You and I have been having them and they've changed and they've ebbed and flowed into different conclusions because of the experiences that we've had now versus maybe how we thought about it when we both met in our early thirties. So I think that remembering that things take time, and although we're hungry for authenticity, we're also needing to learn patience and that it takes time. And that's the beauty of the teacher that teaches year after a year and then becomes the elder and then becomes the one who dispenses wisdom. And that's something lost in our culture is the appreciation that comes with lived experience I think.

Sonya Stattmann: 23:01 Yeah. Well, I think about it in terms of in the olden days it was like apprenticeship, like you would have an apprenticeship or you would have an internship, and some industries still have that, like doctors and things, they have quite a lot of different things they have to do before they can become something. They have practice and work. But I think we've lost that and everybody just wants to be an expert right away. They just want to be like, oh I had one experience, I'm an expert. We just lost the appreciation of like do the apprenticeship, like do the work, like learn from somebody who's already been there, like really give yourself the space to have the experience and to move through it. So I think we have to talk about the line because there's a lot of people who've had a lot of experience and they're not valuing their experience. That is some of the women I work with, but we're not talking about that. We're talking about people I think that haven't had any experience and they instantly want to go out and start a business on something that they may have like a month experience in. And you think that you're not an expert like go and learn from people, go and have small experiences, but everybody wants big things. And I think this is the challenge. With authenticity, it's a journey. I think it's so hard because I find for myself, helping women become more authentic is actually what I'm doing. But it's hard to say now because it's been so tainted, but it is really what I'm doing, it is really the work that I've been doing for a long, long, long time.

Laura Shook Guzman: 24:36 I can actually testify to that everyone. So I used to this word back before it was popular. And that's what you talked about. I mean in some of the first conversations that we had, we talked about our own experience as women and mothers and having our career, and you wanting to have an authentic path and you wanting to help other women not have to compromise themselves. And that's why you and I are both feeling a little bit heartbroken about the direction it's taken, and that it kind of has this shadow dark side of being twisted a little bit because it's such a beautiful thing that more and more women are using business as a way of self-actualizing and finding their voice and showing up, and finally like playing big and showing up. It's got this beautiful root to it.

Sonya Stattmann: 25:28 Yes. And, in some ways, I would say don't worry about it like that. Don't worry about all the marketing. Find the people who feel authentic. And find your own authentic voice. Don't let someone tell you what that is. Find it for yourself because that's the way it has to be. I mean, my clients come in wanting me to sort of help them position themselves and help them with aspects of the business, but the real journey is them finding themselves. Because I can't find them for them, that's not how it works. It is the integration that they create through the program. And sometimes what they find is that the business they came into the program to create is absolutely misaligned with who they are and they go off and do something completely different and that's their result. That's what they got out. They found themselves. I think we have to look at it in terms of it's really just about your own journey and it's really about discovering who you really are. So whether you like the word authentic, don't like the work authentic. It doesn't really matter. What we're looking for is for you to be congruent with yourself, for you to know who you are, for you to stand for who you are. Stop compromising for the world, for other people, for your marketing, for your promotion, just stop compromising yourself altogether.

Laura Shook Guzman: 26:46 I love it. Stop compromising, being congruent and be you, and your truth will shine through. I think that's the really important thing is that when you're speaking your truth and you're coming from that place, people feel it. We've talked about this before, and it's hard to explain, but it's an energy and people can see it and they can feel it coming from your words or coming from the way that you're communicating through your marketing. They can tell the ones that are like, oh wait, this really resonates with me or this feels like they're trying too hard, or they're trying to follow an authentic script.

Sonya Stattmann: 27:27 Yeah, that trying, I think is the keyword. If you're trying, you're not there. Yeah. Right. Like really everyone, if you're trying to be authentic, it means something about what you're doing isn't authentic. You don't need to try. You just need to be. And I think this is the problem with marketing and granted, years ago, I was back at branding like, I get the marketing craft. And there is some solid structure and some skills that you can build in the promotion and marketing side of things. But the truth, you're so much better just being, you just being real, whatever that looks like. So much better these days. Not trying to be you or trying to be authentic, but actually just being whatever that is, whatever that looks like for you. And one of the things I think that's really important to talk about, because I think it's missed a lot, is that start with things that are easy for you to do and be. I think everyone's trying to do everything that everyone is telling them to do. So as an example, I was speaking about this last night, is that I don't do Facebook Lives, they're just not my thing. I don't do Instagram. Not my thing. I love the prettiness of Instagram, but it's just goes against my values on some level. Because it's all pretty, it's all about image. So that, you know, in and of itself, it doesn't work for me, so that's okay. I don't have to be on Instagram. I didn't have to do Facebook Lives, so I picked things to promote myself and to do my marketing that work for me. Like this podcast. I love getting on a podcast. It's effortless to do it. So then I decided this is my medium. This is what I can do. Some people are great at writing, some people love to take pictures of other things or their clients, or whatever it is. Whatever is sort of your lowest hanging fruit, whatever you most feel authentic doing, that's the way to promote yourself. And so stop listening to sort of tactics and strategies that you're constantly fighting with because you know they don't feel real for you.

Laura Shook Guzman: 29:25 Yeah. Stop that comparison. So just stop comparing and looking at what other people are doing and do what it is that you do. And one of the really popular practices that when people are trying to tell their story is to connect to their why. One piece of advice I'm going to say about that, that they forget to add, is that if you're going to get in touch with your why and you're going to write it, make sure you're not writing it for an audience. Don't start editing, writing your why in like marketing speak. You're already seeing it like on your website. Write it as if It's the deepest, quietest secret in your own journal that you're going to lock and put away. Write it from your heart, your own why. And you may not let anyone ever see that or read. You may keep that. But that is why that you need to write first, and then you can figure out where to go from there. But I think that we rarely get to write that why. Because we've already flipped into selfie mode as you were talking about, like already looking at observer. How are people going to see me? How are people going to read this? What are they going to think about my why, does my why sound selfish? Does it sound cool? Is it on point? Like, what's my why? That's not it. Go into writing it. It's like when I tell my clients, write the letter to that person that you never planned to send and say everything that you need to say without editing yourself. That's the why that you need to also be writing for your business.

Sonya Stattmann: 30:59 That's the marketing that you need to be doing. Really. Like, I mean I feel like I have to unwind everybody's ideas of marketing. Because you have to take, you have to strip them back. So some people come and I can tell them like, who are you writing to? What is this marketing speak? What audience is in your head? And you think about in terms of like, I hate elevator speeches personally. Like I don't believe in them. You should not memorize an introduction of what you do because it just sounds inauthentic. After you've done it three times and you've memorized it, they will never ever sound authentic again. So what I try to get my clients in the practice of is just saying something new each time, like just, really feeling what it is they want to say what they do and just practicing like, shifting it and changing it and like feeling in the moment what it feels like because I think that that becomes more authentic. So sometimes I'm like, well, what would you say to your best friend if they were like, hey, what are you doing now? You'd say something plain, you wouldn't give them marketing speak. So why would you give a client or a prospect marketing speak? But why wouldn't you tell them like, you tell your best friend? I mean, this is what people want. It is real. This is what I struggle within sort of the authentic market especially, so the wellness practitioners, the coaches, the people who are selling authenticness. It's like you never really understand what they do, but what do you do? Oh, well I teach women to love themselves and I'm like, that's awesome, but what do you do? Or I teach authentic empowering. They use all these words and you're like, but what does that mean?!

Laura Shook Guzman: 32:43 I empower authentic reconnection to the greater divine feminine...

Sonya Stattmann: 32:53 You know the Divine Feminine stuff that I talk about that's all personal. Like I don't share any of that on my marketing. Like that's all my personal why. That's all my personal integration. Like no one would understand what the hell I'm talking about if I put that in my marketing. They'd be like, this girl's a little whack. Like what's she talking about? So I think that's the piece, is there's a difference between what I understand because I have so much context around it and what someone in the real world connecting with me is going to understand because they have none of that context.

Laura Shook Guzman: 33:23 Well, this was not as ranty as it could have been, I think was made some valid points. Hopefully, the listeners think so too. But I think it's a good conversation. Anytime we see something that is popular within our work environments, it's important to look at like, hmm, what do we think about that? And how can we go kind of at that angle from a place of understanding, is that true for me? Is this something that works for me? And if so, how do I make it more in alignment? Like you're saying how am I more congruent with myself. And I think this is all again a part of the learning process that your business is your teacher, your business does help you become more and more clear. It will encourage you to ask these questions. And your clients will be encouraging you to ask these questions. Like pushes us to our edge. And I think personally that that's what I know I'm on the right path when it's challenging me a little bit to think deeper.

Sonya Stattmann: 34:29 Yeah, love that. It's so much about thinking deeper. I think what I really hope everyone just takes away from this is it's about being authentic, not trying to be authentic. So don't worry about what anybody else is doing. Just worry about what you're doing and how authentic you are and how it's coming across. I think most people feel like what they're putting out doesn't feel like them. They feel like it's something they've been told to do. They feel icky about it and the ickiness is not marketing in and of itself and it's not promotion in and of itself and it's not sales in and of itself. It literally is that we're doing things that are misaligned with our nature. And when we know who we are and we're doing it with good intention, then it's totally from a powerful place. And then promotion, marketing and sales are authentic. We'll wrap it up with that. I think this has been a great conversation. We'd love to continue it with you in our Facebook group, so if you haven't joined our Facebook group, Women in the Business Arena, it's a great place. We do like a podcast discussion every Wednesday and so when we have this one out, you know it'd be awesome for you to come and play with us. So thank you and we will you next week.

Speaker 1: 35:39 Thanks so much for listening to the show. You can dive into more of the conversation in our Facebook group, Women in the Business Arena. You can also access all of our episodes and some great resources at Women in the Business Arena.com. Our mission is to arm more women with the tools, strategies, and know how to navigate the business arena with ease, so they can create more success, more fulfillment, and more liberation. If you're enjoying the show and want to support our mission, you can write a review on iTunes or share with your friends. A huge thank you to all of you who commented, reviewed, and shared our show. We are so appreciative of your support. Okay. Talk to you next week.

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